Cold Tdi Starting - Please Help Diagnose

[love_dem_galaxies]

Hi - I have been a reader of this excellent forum for years and can usually find a solution by searching but now I'm stumped and have been forced to post a message!

I have an S reg 1.9 TDI 110BHP engine code AFN with 120k on the clock and since the cold weather started last year have been getting starting problems.

The problem happens when the engine is cold and when it has been standing for a long time - so first thing in the morning and around 6 pm when I start it at work for the journey home.

I wait around 3 seconds then power off and then switch on again for a few seconds to make sure the glow plugs are really hot then try and start it.

After around 5 seconds it starts to fire but I have to keep the starter going for 10 - 15 seconds (seems like forever) before it will stay running.

Once its running (apart from the embarrassing massive clouds of smoke from the unburnt fuel) it runs fantastic with loads of power and as long as I don't leave it for longer than say a couple of hours will fire up again straight away.

 

I have read every starting problem post on this form and the associated posts on the TDI forum (pointless as TDI forum said it was my immobilizer!!!)

 

I have changed the glow plugs - and found one of the ones i took out was high resistance bu made hardly any difference.

New exhaust - not that this will change anything.

Battery is fine (and needs to be!)

The auxillary heater under the car stopped working - and may have been around the time the problems started but thats a guess as both were noticed when the weather got cold.

Glow plug light has never worked (read below)

 

I think it is something to do with one of the following but can't get any further -

 

A - Air getting into the fuel line - When it has been standing, I can see a bubble forming and moving down the transparent bit of the fuel pipe, however I cant see any fuel leaks so if air is getting in then why isn't fuel getting out when under pressure. Is there a non-return valve to stop this?

 

B - Relay 109? - I have read a lot about this issue but when I went to my Ford dealer they told me that in my GLX there was no such device with that name - they even printed out the screen showing the fuse panel and each layer under it with every fuse and relay and R109 does not exist! The reason I think that this may have 'some' bearing on the problem is that although the solenoid on the top of the injector pump clunks when I start the car, when I got my other half (she's golden!) to hold a meter on the terminal it showed around 8 volts plus it appeared intermittent.

I also have never had a glow plug light - it didn't stop the car starting and when I tried to fix it a few years back i traced it back to the ECU where no volts where coming out of the pin. I can confirm however that I get full volts for 3 seconds to the glow plugs.

 

I would be so grateful if some one could offer some ideas.

 

Thanks

 

Mark (Scoobie)

Edited March 10, 2010 by love_dem_galaxies

[Stoneblade]

A - Air getting into the fuel line - When it has been standing, I can see a bubble forming and moving down the transparent bit of the fuel pipe, however I cant see any fuel leaks so if air is getting in then why isn't fuel getting out when under pressure. Is there a non-return valve to stop this?

 

This will deffinatly be the problem, I dont know on the mk 1 is they have a non return valve but on my mk 2 I had a fault with mine and it started the fuel leaking back in to the tank and the mornings it was a heller to get the bugger going. I would hold the key on start for about 10 secs until the engine started to turn over then it would run rough for about 5 seconds and smooth out.

 

Couple of things you could try is to park the car facing down hill so gravity doesnt pull the fuel back down the line. What I tried is clamping the fuel pipe (rubber part) with something over night so it would act as a non return valve, dont clamp too tight else you will have to replace the pipe. Just ordered a valve from Ford for

[JC1520]

Hi - I have been a reader of this excellent forum for years and can usually find a solution by searching but now I'm stumped and have been forced to post a message!

I have an S reg 1.9 TDI 110BHP engine code AFN with 120k on the clock and since the cold weather started last year have been getting starting problems.

The problem happens when the engine is cold and when it has been standing for a long time - so first thing in the morning and around 6 pm when I start it at work for the journey home.

I wait around 3 seconds then power off and then switch on again for a few seconds to make sure the glow plugs are really hot then try and start it.

After around 5 seconds it starts to fire but I have to keep the starter going for 10 - 15 seconds (seems like forever) before it will stay running.

Once its running (apart from the embarrassing massive clouds of smoke from the unburnt fuel) it runs fantastic with loads of power and as long as I don't leave it for longer than say a couple of hours will fire up again straight away.

 

I have read every starting problem post on this form and the associated posts on the TDI forum (pointless as TDI forum said it was my immobilizer!!!)

 

I have changed the glow plugs - and found one of the ones i took out was high resistance bu made hardly any difference.

New exhaust - not that this will change anything.

Battery is fine (and needs to be!)

The auxillary heater under the car stopped working - and may have been around the time the problems started but thats a guess as both were noticed when the weather got cold.

Glow plug light has never worked (read below)

 

I think it is something to do with one of the following but can't get any further -

 

A - Air getting into the fuel line - When it has been standing, I can see a bubble forming and moving down the transparent bit of the fuel pipe, however I cant see any fuel leaks so if air is getting in then why isn't fuel getting out when under pressure. Is there a non-return valve to stop this?

 

B - Relay 109? - I have read a lot about this issue but when I went to my Ford dealer they told me that in my GLX there was no such device with that name - they even printed out the screen showing the fuse panel and each layer under it with every fuse and relay and R109 does not exist! The reason I think that this may have 'some' bearing on the problem is that although the solenoid on the top of the injector pump clunks when I start the car, when I got my other half (she's golden!) to hold a meter on the terminal it showed around 8 volts plus it appeared intermittent.

I also have never had a glow plug light - it didn't stop the car starting and when I tried to fix it a few years back i traced it back to the ECU where no volts where coming out of the pin. I can confirm however that I get full volts for 3 seconds to the glow plugs.

 

I would be so grateful if some one could offer some ideas.

 

Thanks

 

Mark (Scoobie)

Mark

 

I am keen to know if you ever manage to fix your issue with starting problems on your Galaxy

 

I am having a strange issue

 

When i try to start in the morning if i turn the key on and swing it over immeditly it will start ok some time a bit lumpy for 3 and runs find after no power issues nothing

 

It will be find pretty much all day it is seamless starting after the first start up

if i leave it for a whole day in the park at work sometimes if i miss that first turn over i have to make 2-3 if not 4 attempts before it starts once it turns over once then it is good to go.

 

This may sound stupid has this Auxcillery heater got any impact on its starting

 

what does relay 109 do

 

any help will be welcome

[zorgman]

aux heater has nowt to do with starting, things to check

if you got air in line then methinks thats your problem

glow plugs dont stop these engines starting unless its way below 0

timing can be an issue if its to far retaraded

if it starts instant say after a hour its deffo air leak in fuel line

[marinabrid]

must be different dealers, i went to my local ford dealer and asked for a relay 109 for a 98 s reg tdi 110 galaxy he got the slide out and there it was, ordered, here next day fitted in 15 mins, didnt make the slightest difference to our poor starting.

 

ours starts quick, then if you stop if within a few seconds it is a sod to restart, could this be down to the fuel non return valve ?

 

would this valve show as faulty on vag com,

 

i think relay 109 is for all starting things like glow plugs etc etc i could be wrong and im sure someone will tell us so and hopefully put us right