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Posted

Looks like it might be curtains for the old gal - we've had it for years - I've mended just about everything on it but I fear the end is nigh!! :lol:

 

Wife was driving down the dual carriage way when the gal started running a bit rough. Then she noticed lots of smoke out of the exhaust with stares from passing motorists!

 

Pulls over and gets the recovery service out.

 

When I get to look at her a very strange crime scene.

 

Tried cranking it over. Spins over fast but not doing much - can't even hear it trying to do anything - no compression type noises

 

Took the cover off the coils and one of them has failed big time - grey smoke everywhere. However deeper investigation reveals much worse - the plug under the coil has come adrift, the ht connection between the coil and plug is wrecked.

 

Strangely the plug electrode looks a perfect colour - but the gap is completely closed. The plug thread in the head is wrecked.

 

Not sure exactly what has happened so try to do a compression test:-

 

 

No1 - zero - no compression!

 

No2 - can't fit the gauge as this is the one with the failed plug and thread.

 

No3 - about 180

 

No4 - fed up by this point so can't remember.

 

Pistons go up and down and the cam visible through the oil filler cap goes round - so I know the cam chain hasn't failed!

 

Clearly the head has got to come off to have a helicoil fitted in the No2 spark plug hole. I fear though it will be much worse when I delve deeper!!

 

Anybody know how long to remove a head on the 2.3? I've had a look in the haynes and it is awful - the procedure jumps through three or four sections - so I thought I'd ask on here first.

 

Thanks

Posted

Looks as if the piston crown may have whacked the plug out - is that possible? :lol: big end detached?

 

Only other thing I can think of is a valve head somehow became detached and dropped into the chamber.......

 

No compression on adjacent cylinder? Strange - stuck valve or hole in piston?

 

LPG eh?

 

Methinks its a scrapper........

Posted (edited)

Wow... that doesn't sound very good. :(

 

The fact that the plug which has been ejected is showing damage would point to something in there that shouldn't be there... like seatkid, I'm also thinking a piece of valve is the most likely candidate, probably now embedded in the piston. With a good cylinder head gasket, problems affecting 2 or more cylinders would always point me towards the valve gear, and the lack of compression on 1 is most likely connected. If valves are broken, expect some damage to head and piston crowns.

 

I would think the best place to start would be to whip the rocker cover off, so you can see what is happening to both cams as the engine is turned by hand. As the inlet cam is turning, it could be that something has happened to the exhaust cam. If all looks reasonably normal, have a look at the lobe clearances to see if any valves are stuck out, a sure sign something is damaged.

 

I don't think taking the head off should be particularly difficult, theres a fair amount of room to work around the head, and I would think 2-3 hours careful dismantling should see the head on the bench. Try to be logical in approach, make notes and take a few pics of the pipework/wiring if possible.

 

I hope it's not too bad, good luck! :lol:

Edited by sparky Paul
Posted

Sorry to hear your trusty steed is ill

 

If you have a decent jack n stands it might be worth taking the sump off and have a look to see if the conrod's are still attached to the big end

 

If you sold it as is you might get 350 to 450 ebay

 

food for thought new 2.0 zetec engine's are going for 500 on ebay

 

any ways here have a virtual beer sounds like you could do with one

Posted

Thanks for the replies so far.

 

It's not making any clattering noises and I did get a neighbour to crank it over whilst I peered down the plug holes with a torch - I thought all the pistons were going up and down?

 

Have started to look round on Ebay for a cheap Gal ( - ha - that's a joke - they all seem to have intergalactic miles on them and even then they want silly money) or a replacement engine.

 

I think my engine choice is limited to the plain 2.3 - anything else would be too much work. Even a 2.3 Zetec I'm guessing might have additional sensors, new ECU etc?? Ours has only got 105K miles on it so I have a real mental block with buying anything anywhere near that mileage - although I see many go way beyond this.

 

Ah -well - I didn't have anything better to do than spend hours pulling the old gal apart :lol:

 

Cheers

Steve

Posted

post-22888-1248812727_thumb.jpg

 

Hey your problem sounds like the very one i had a couple o months ago.

 

I thought the head gasket had gone so took head off got the whole thing skimmed and got a new set of head bolts and a head gasket set to put the thing back together then noticed one of the pistons had a chunk missing from the top edge and a cylinder bore had a mark on the side like there was something stuck to it. Closer investigation reveled the piston had a hole in the side. Check the piston on the left. Best bet is take head off but it does take a bit of work and take a look. I have got a spare head complete timing chain and tensioner head bolts and gasket for sale if needed

Posted
I think we do. I have binned the lpg as i fitted a new engine and when started it the engine was miss firing checked and changed plugs coil pack and anything else i could think off. i decided to cut the lpg system out and had to rewire the injectors proper pain in the arse. Turned the key and run sweet as a nut. New engine cost 400 buks and only had 62,000 on it. Old engine had done 142,000. I hate to think how much i spent on gaskets and everything else before i bought the engine.
Posted

142,000 is not too bad.

 

We've run LPG for almost 90,000 miles and saved a small fortune. I do wonder though if the piston or valves run a tad hotter and that's what causes problems.

 

Where did you get your engine from - did you use the on-line scrappers or was it ebay.

 

Thanks

Posted
I found one on ebay the lad had bought it to convert his mk5 escort rs 2000 but never did Not got the stuff on ebay as never have time I got a garage of various spares for different cars just sitting there every time i remember i aint got my camera with me. When i bought the car the fella said the gas works perfectly and when i tried to drive home it only worked on petrol. i got a mile from home and the temp gauge went to cold and the red warning light came on. Closer inspection the heater hose had came off a t-piece for the gas. This happened twice and the second time i got a puff o blue smoke out the rear and that was the start of the headaches. So no more gas conversions for me i think
Posted

Ok thanks.

 

Once I've got the head off I'll know what I'm looking at.

 

If I go for a rebuild I might be in touch for some of those bits you've got. If there's any risk of bent conrods, crank or the cost of a rebore and regrind looks silly I'll be after another engine.

 

I'll post an update in a few days - probably not till the weekend.

 

Thanks

Posted
If there's any risk of bent conrods, crank or the cost of a rebore and regrind looks silly I'll be after another engine.

That sounds very sensible to me.

 

As an owner of a 2.3 with increasing miles, I look forward to hearing how you get on... and good luck again. :P

 

One a brighter note, and completely OT, mine passed the MOT today with back discs and front tyres as advisories. :unsure:

  • 1 month later...
Posted (edited)

Well it's been a while what with holidays, work, vectra failing it's MOT (it's only a 2005!!).

 

Anyway finally got the head off today and did not find the mess that I was expecting.

 

the head has a tiny crack between one of the exhaust valves and the spark plug hole. This must be why the plug eventually came loose - causing the coil to fail then taking another cylinder out of operation.

 

Couldn't see anything wrong with the head gasket - although with it being a three piece sandwich affair it could have failed in the middle layer I suppose. However all the pistons look the same and the head chambers are all the same except for number two which is a little blacker - not much.

 

Can't see why I got the compression figures I did. The bores look very good for 100K - I wouldn't be disappointed if the car had only done 50K - there is no lip at all!

 

My thoughts on this are:-

 

Operator error - did I remember to open the throttle?

 

The gauge is bust - I did notice on the the one good figure I managed to get that it gauge was leaking and would not hold the reading. - it was leaking slowly.

 

Anyway I need to get a valve spring compressor - neither of the two I've got reach deep enough - oh dear!!

 

Anybody else had a head crack like this?

 

Is it likely to be repairable (never had a head repaired before). I could try and get a second hand head but chances are it'll cost almost as much as some people are selling engines for and there is no gaurantee it will be any better!

 

Cheers

Steve

Edited by Steve P
  • 3 weeks later...

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