Petrol Or Diesel

[Andrew T]

I

[Guest thobbs]

Sounds about right! I have heard that the petrol Vs. Diesel will always depend on the mileage involved. Also older diesel's are cheaper than the petrol equiv. as the older diesel's were dirty black smoke puffing, rattling engines, whereas the newer, say 3 years old are very much cleaner and quieter. So the selling price of the petrol Vs. diesel will be about the same or the diesel *may* make more money!

[greg_68]

I think a lot depends on how much you pay for the car and how long you keep it for.

 

I paid

[GSMGuy]

FWIW, I drive a diesel for the torque and effortless overtaking... In my TDi 115 Gal, I averaged 31mpg over 12 months and 11500 miles... In my new ML270Cdi I am averaging 25.8 over the first 1000 or so miles of ownership... I do drive my cars hard, and I don't drive for economy... God help me If I had a VR6... Maybe 15mpg? Or and ML320... Prob nearer 10mpg!

 

Mike

[Andrew T]

If you recalculated your figures but keeping your car for 6 years instead of 3 you would probably end up saving money having a diesel.

 

Okay, let

[Bigjeeze]

Blimey this is all a bit serious!

 

I think this is a swings & roundabouts one - It will depend on a number of factors - Age, Condition, (and the vehicles) whether financed or bought outright and indeed mileage and useage.

 

As with all financial decisions you need to assess your personal situation not a generic one.

 

I paid

[Denis]

Thanks for doing the maths on this Andrew T, you've confirmed what I have always suspected about petrol vs diesel running costs. :(

 

Though I think you forgot to factor in the cost of a couple of MAF's and an aux heater into the list of expenses for the diesel. :angry:

[Guest marcusheawood]

Oh boy, I got flamed badly for mentioning this about six months ago, I couldn't be bothered to argue at the time.

 

Seriously though my VR6 has not missed a beat mechanically in two years, my servicing costs have been purely oil and filters (and as I've already stated I don't waste money on Posh Oil).

 

It seems to me that it's the running gear on Shalaxys which gives all the trouble due to poor build and component scrimping. The aircon always plays up, loads of electrical niggles and busted plastics etc. etc.

 

These problems are the same whether you have a diseasal or a petrol. As my little poll shows the engines and 'boxes are basically reliable if serviced correctly.

 

Gotta say it though; THE VAST MAJORITY OF DRIVETRAIN PROBLEMS SEEM TO HAPPEN TO DIESEL OWNERS.

 

I'd be surpised if my VR6 misses a beat until well past 200K (I have no intention of replacing it until it dies horribly anyway), the manual 'box will start to lose sychro about then as well. It'll need a clutch at about 125K, alternator and starter at around 150K and a power steering rack or pump sometime after that.

 

If you buy a secondhand car, repair and maintain it yourself and keep it until it dies then the savings make fuel costs irrelevant.

 

Diesels only make sense at around 25K per year, and the depreciation on newer vehicles makes them an absurd luxury!

[GSMGuy]

Hmm... Depreciation... My new car cost

[Bigjeeze]

Ok

 

Here it is then - Unless you are using a vehicle for a business purpose and can offset the cost against overhead and generate or contribute to a profit it is a waste of money owning a half decent car of any flavour.

 

I don't think that more than 5% of vehicle owners can actually cost justify the vehicle they have. Work it out - unless you are using it for a lot of miles it would ALWAYS be cheaper to use public transport.

 

We all are really quite aware of what our vehicles cost us to run - we just don't like to think about it. I agree that yopu can successfully argue that one or another is cheaper or more efficent to run than another - but justify it's running costs? No chance.

 

I don't drink or smoke , have no major vices - except my car. That's it!!! :ph34r:

[_dg]

Remember if you run your diesels on vegetable oil, then there is a potential 40-50% saving in fuel costs :ph34r:

[Guest marcusheawood]

...Illegally that is!

 

The smell gives it away you know, and they'll nick you if you haven't paid duty on it. :ph34r:

[burundi]

Legal-duty pre-paid vege oil can be had for about 66p a litre. Not a bad saving. I'm seriously considering having mine converted next year.

 

You can always buy some duty pre-paid vege oil on a regular basis and top-up occasionally with non duty-paid (for emergencies etc...).

[sasquartch]

I bought a brand new Galaxy Silver TDI in March. This is basically the cheapest model you can get - it cost only about 1000 more than a 2.3 petrol. I don't do a huge mileage but I reckon I easily save 10-15 quid a week on fuel so it will pay for itself in less than two years. If I sell the car I will get all of the 1000 premium back compared with a petrol, although I'm intending to keep it 10 years and assume it'll be worth nothing at the end. Servicing will be more expensive but I still think if buying new the diesel is the best buy. However the case for a second hand diesel is often harder to make unless you're doing a high mileage.

[El Dingo]

Really interesting stuff Andrew T.

 

For a saloon car and high milage I worked it out in favour of diesel, so I bought one - and now regret it, especially with regard to driving enjoyment, and the economy certainly isn't as good as promised.

 

So when we needed a MPV I bought a (petrol) Galaxy. I love the Galaxy... I have to fight my wife to get the keys off her at the weekend...

[_dg]

Legal-duty pre-paid vege oil can be had for about 66p a litre. Not a bad saving. I'm seriously considering having mine converted next year.

 

You can always buy some duty pre-paid vege oil on a regular basis and top-up occasionally with non duty-paid (for emergencies etc...).

No need to convert, just mix veg with diesel. I've been running my pick up on it for a few months now.

 

The Police can't/won't nick you as using is is not a crime, but avoiding duty is. You pay duty at monthly intervals, so you pay retrospectively. The Police are not really geared up for testing or dealing with this, so it is down to C&E - who are under resourced.

 

So the chance of getting your collar felt is remote. Anyway, you can just register as a fuel producer, and at the end of the month just declare 'non used' or something like 10 litres worth. :ph34r:

 

And the smell is lovely

[Guest Simon S]

When I bought my 2.3 Zetec in the Summer I saw that for the price of a petrol with 23,000 on the clock was around

[burundi]

No need to convert, just mix veg with diesel. I've been running my pick up on it for a few months now.

My concern with mixing it in with the diesel is the long term effects on the engine.

 

I don't have an option of using another vehicle if this one dies on me and I don't want to coke up the engine.

 

For my conversion I'm looking at a two tank heated system whereby the vehicles main tank is used for vege oil and a small secondary tank (20 litres approx) is used for Diesel, you start and shutdown the engine on diesel but when the vege oil is up to temp (about 75 degrees celcius) you switch over to it and run on pure vege oil.

 

This gives you the benefit of being able to cold start on diesel and flushing the vege oil out of the engine before you shut it down which prevents coking and the oil coagulating on components when it's cold.

[widu13]

It's got to be down to what you pay for it. If two cars more or less the same price come along, one petrol and one diesel MOST (not all) people will get the diesel.

 

This is how I ended up with my Gal in May. 2 years old and

[Andrew T]

I suspect if I'd done this 6 months ago the calculation would have been in favour of the Diesel, as I'm sure the recent hikes in fuel prices will have put used Diesel values up and Petrol values down.

Anyone buying new would be crazy to buy a petrol if there's only a thousand or so difference in cost, however in the secondhand market cars find their own value and I think this illustrates it pays to think carefully before you chose which to go for and not assume the Diesel will be always cheapest.

[Andrew T]

FWIW, I drive a diesel for the torque and effortless overtaking...

The question of the relative overtaking performance of Petrol and Diesel is an interesting one. I admit that I have not driven any of the

[johnb80]

Clearly you are very out of date, take a look at the performance figures especially 31 to 62 mph in top gear and you will see just how well modern diesels perform. Turbolag just doesn't exist any more to any noticeable degree.

 

Comparing 2.3 / diesel

 

MPG @ 56mph 36.2 / 51.4

31 to 62mph 13.5 / 12.9 (Yes oil burner wins and Petrol in 5th, diesel in 6th)

0 to 62mph 12.7 / 12.8 only 0.1 seconds slower.

 

Regards - JB

[widu13]

The BMW 535 petrol and diesel have exactly the same 0-60 figures, but from there on including 50-70 and top speed the diesel is faster.

[El Dingo]

I have a state-of-the-art A4 2.0 TDi, and Andrew T is very nearly spot on (apart from turbo lag - there isn't any).

 

My wife's old car (before the Galaxy) was a 2.6 A4 petrol. This is 150 bhp and 162 lbsft torque. The A4 2.0 TDi is 138 bhp and 236 lbsft. Both hit 60 mph in around 9.5 seconds.

 

In day-to-day around town driving the diesel is quicker - on the open road the petrol V6 was much, much faster, and a much better bet for overtaking. And a lot more fun.

 

MPG figures (and I'm not cheating; I keep accurate records - both cars high milage business use):

A4 2.6 petrol manual - average 29.59

A4 2.0 diesel - average 41.74

 

For my money I'll take the petrol (and yes, I must be crazy!).

 

Why is it that diesel costs so much more here than petrol - higher duty? In Germany and Switzerland over the last few weeks - Diesel is cheaper than 95 octane petrol. I expect duty on diesel to increase faster than petrol over the next two years. :ph34r:

[johnb80]

I expect duty on diesel to increase faster than petrol over the next two years. <_<

It will never happen, too much of our infrastucture relies on diesel i.e. buses, lorries etc. If the duty goes up inflation would rapidly follow and the government would not want that.

Re petrol / diesel debat, you are forgetting that the 2.3 and the 115 diesel are similar from a power point of view whereas your comparison the V6 should be shed loads better. With diesel it takes a while to get used to not revving it, the performance is all low down, if redlining through the gears you're not running at it's best. I usually manually change mine down to 4th to prevent kickdown if I want a rapid overtake, normally though there's enough go without kicking down and the manual change isn't needed.

 

Regards - JB