Coolant Leak

[Ex-Galaxy person]

My suspicions about a gradual coolant loss were confirmed today when the low level warning came up on the dash - only a couple of weeks after ensuring the expansion tank was topped up because the light had come on previously........ investigation with a torch showed some pools of coolant sitting on top of the gearbox casing (it was blue/green - not rainwater!). I'm just pleased it's not the water pump! So this weekend's job is to pull out the battery and tray and take a look. It's not overheating and the fuel economy/performance is still good, so I'm also fairly sure it's nothing more serious.

 

I've not really had to pull many things apart on this car, so my main question to those who have is whether there's a common issue with the cooling system that manifests itself in this area? It's collecting on the gearbox casing, so I must be relatively high in the engine bay.

 

TIA

[Stevoo]

Proberly a split hoses of a faulty gasket on the Thermostate/water housing joint.

Just check all pipes for leaks.

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Thanks Stevoo.

 

Just another question. I've noticed that the cooling system is pressurized even when cold - there's a loud hiss when I undo the cap on the expansion tank and the coolant level actually goes up in the expansion tank. I'm sure it never happened on any other car I've owned, except when the engine is warm - never when stone cold.

 

Is the cooling system supposed to be pressurized when cold? Just wondering if the expansion tank cap is faulty...which has caused excess pressure....which has caused the leak......

[sepulchrave]

Ouch, the only fault which could create that issue is head gasket failure I'm afraid.

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Head gasket failure was something someone else said as well. What I'm surprised about is that there are no other symptoms such as:

 

overheating

steamy exhaust

poor performance/fuel economy

creamy substance in oil

 

If it is the head gasket, then it's been like that for at least a month and about 1000 miles - it was about a month ago I first topped up the coolant and that's the only symptom. I ran it up to temperature this evening with the cap off the header tank and the coolant just sat there, getting warmer - no bubbling up, which is what I'd expect from a gas being forced through a liquid.

 

A mechanic friend of mine thinks it's unlikely to be the head gasket, so opinion seems to be divided. What do others think?

[Stevoo]

Get a sniffer test done from any garage.

Some headgasket fail but dont show them other issue until its to late.

[mustafe]

I had recently experienced similar problem (i.e. losing coolant water and low level warning light came up), and I have topped up the water and after few days it came back, then I removed the under cover shield and found greenish water under the oil sump and top of the gearbox. I traced this greenish water and found that the pipe which feeds the water pump was leaking slightly! Then I did not bother to replace the pipe as the weather wasn

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Just thought I'd give an update on this in case it's helpful to anyone now or in the future.

 

I took the battery out in in daylight at the weekend so I could see what was going on around the expansion tank area - and the battery tray was wet with coolant. I inspected the cooling system and could find no trace of a leak anywhere else. The conclusion is that it's venting from the expansion tank cap area (there looks to be a hole on the underside of the neck where it can do this). I asked my mechanic mate round (he's got 30+ years experience in the trade) and told him about my head gasket worry. We ran the engine up to temperature until the cooling fans cut in. All the coolant pipes were still soft (he said they'd be hard if exhaust gas was pressurising the system - no bubbling up of gas through the expansion tank, and no smell of diesel exhaust fumes coming from the expansion tank.

 

He also advised that, in his experience, sniffers weren't particularly sensitive, especially in cases like this when there are no other symptoms presenting themselves (no overheating, economy/performance still excellent, no cream in oil, no steamy exhaust).

 

So, what I'm going to do is:

 

1. Replace the expansion tank cap (on order from Frauds).

 

if this doesn't work,

 

2. try some K-Seal - http://www.k-seal.co.uk/

 

Two other things I've learned this weekend: the Mk1 TDi (non-PD engine) does not have a run-on pump, and it's normal for the cooling system to be slightly pressurised even when cold.

 

hope this helps someone, and if/when I find the cause/solution I'll post it here.

[draughtyknee]

I have been topping up a 2004 2.3 Zetec a lot in the run up to identifying a leak from the thermostat housing which has now - hopefully - been fixed by a Ford dealer.

 

I too noticed the syndrome of wet battery housing and of the hole under the expansion tank's filler hole. The expansion tank is so awkward to access that even when topping up carefully, I know that some went in the wrong part of the filler and hence straight out of the hole underneath. Hopefully I now have the right thing to not top it up messily next time but even so I know it won't be easy.

 

So I shall be very interested to watch this topic to see if it's just a question of not being clumsy when topping up with coolant, or whether the Galaxy is prone to delivering (presumably hot, pressurised) coolant to the battery & associated electrics (which can't be good for it) all on its own every once in a while.

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Just to give an update....

 

In the week leading up to replacing the coolant cap (between ordering and collecting!), I placed a piece of paper under the vent - it was blue by the end of the week with vented coolant.

 

The new cap has been on a week - and the new piece of paper is clean. I really need to wait a month to confirm, but I think that's solved it.

 

Two things I learned whilst investigating this problem:

 

1. The cooling system is pressurised even when cold.

2. There is no run-on pump on the Mk1 (non PD engine).

 

I also use a funnel when topping up virtually everything on this car!

[bondhigh]

hey phil

 

im having the same problem, i have changed the bottle and cap and the water is still going somewhere, can anyone help?

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Hey bondhigh and all,

 

Apologies for delay in replying, but here's the latest, in case it's of any use to anyone.

 

New coolant tank cap solved problem for about month, then started to lose it again - then, last week, it started to run hot - intermittently! Typically would be OK for a run of say 20 miles, then stop car - leave a while, then use again...and it overheats.

 

Mechanic friend is currently unavailable, so it went to local Frauds today for diagnosis. In the run over to garage (6 miles) - didn't overheat, but mechanic took it out almost immediately and it started to overheat almost immediately. They eventually diagnosed a faulty thermostat; as they had the cooling system in bits by that point it made sense to let them finish the job, although I was slightly irritated by having them do a job I could do myself. That said, they did also check for head gasket failure - they did a block test/cooling system pressure test (are these the same thing?) and a sniffer test, and it all came back negative, which I'm pleased about and I couldn't do that stuff, so I guess that is money well spent.

 

So I'm hoping that's sorted it out; however, I'm surprised a faulty thermostat could have only caused pressurising of the system for 3 months. Temperature-wise, it has been normal, up to about a week ago, and I would normally associate thermostat failure with overheating or running too cool. So for me, the jury is still out, at least for a month.

 

Other HG failure indicators remain negative: fuel economy/performance still good, no vapour in exhaust, no cream in oil.

 

Watch this space......

 

Phillip

[mikeprice]

Sounds a lot like I have the same problem

 

Yesterday I bought a V 2000 Galaxy 1.9 TDI 110 ps.

 

On the way back after about 10 miles it started to get hot so I pulled over and checked the coolant seemed a little low so I topped it up.

 

A further 5 miles and it was hot again so I rested it and drove a the half a mile or so home.

 

Today thinking it was a water leak I have filled it up and then run it on the drive for 20 mins can't see any leaks and the temp was normal.

 

Took it for a drive 30 miles or so up some nice high peak terrain and still no problems.

 

Left it to cold down and went the same run as earlier and it got hot again (heater was running cold air)

 

I noticed that only 1 of the fans on the radiator was working and that the water level was low, on removing the water tank cap the level went back up.

 

I can see from recent receipts that the car had a new water pump and a new thermostat in December 2007 so I rang the Ford Dealer that did them and they confirmed that they replaced them and pressure tested the head with no faults found.

 

I have no idea where to start with the cooling system on this vehicle so any advice would be fantastic.

 

Thanks

 

Mike

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Mike,

 

You could try running without the thermostat - on the Mk1 you have to remove the power steering pump to get at it.

 

My mechanic friend said that even testing for HG failure doesn't always find it - he had a Supra that passed three HG tests and it was still boiling over. In the end he replaced the HG anyway, and it was fine. I'd also say that the fact it passed a HG test in December doesn't mean it hasn't started to fail in the intervening 3 months.

 

I towed the trailer tent with mine today - reasoned that an extra 500kg would make it overheat if it was going to! It did run slightly hotter than it used to, but it didn't overheat. Coolant level has also remained constant. Fingers crossed....

 

I take it that there are no other symptoms?

 

Phillip

[Scorpiorefugee]

Mike,

 

Just a couple of quick thoughts on your problem.

 

First, are you sure that it is in fact overheating, could be a sender problem. Heater running cold suggests something more serious.

 

Second, here was a series of posts by a chap with a persistent overheating problem and it turned out that he had chipped his engine and that was the cause of the problem.

 

Also, These engines seem to run happily on low/normal stress conditions with the water pump rotor detatched, so even if the pump has been replaced, there could still be a problem in that area.

 

Finally, re the water loss, I had this problem for about 20 k miles and, eventally, the garage changed the water pump and the problem went away.

 

I believe that a lot of problems are made worse by poor diagnosis so take your time and I hope you get it sorted. I got mine looking as if it had had a hard life with 140K and a few odd problems. All the problems turned out to be something easy to fix, once diagnosed correctly, and it has now done 210k and I cannot imagine life without it.

 

Ron.

Edited April 13, 2008 by Scorpiorefugee

[mikeprice]

Update

 

I've flushed the system and refilled the coolant, ran the car for 6 miles and it was hot the water bottle was empty so I filled it again (took ~1.5 litres) ran it

 

for 5 miles running hot and bottle empty again (took ~1.5 Litres), refilled the bottle did 40 miles without any problems.

 

One thing I did notice was that the bottom hose never got warm never mind hot whilst the top hose was very hot even after the 40 mile run where it seemed to work without any cooling problems

 

Wouldn't I notice something if it was a head problem given the amount of water it used?

 

The car drives and pulls great other than this, it has done a warranted 78k miles and seems to have had no expense spared looking at the pile or reciepts that came with it

 

Thanks

 

Mike

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Hey all,

 

And the latest.....overheated today after a few miles at 70(ish) mph. Waited about 10-15 mins for it to cool down, then continued journey home at steady 60 without any problems - temp gauge stayed in the middle. Lost about 750ml of coolant through venting.

 

Here are the next steps:

 

1. I had bypassed the ambient temperature sensor for the booster heater at the beginning of the winter - otherwise it had to be near-Siberian temp for it to cut in. It occurred to me it might be firing up the booster, but never switching off, so I've replaced the bridge with the sensor, so it shouldn't fire up at all now when the engine is cold.

 

2. Water pump replacement will be next job if #1 doesn't work - I think Ron's comment about these engines running with the pump rotor detached makes sense considering how thermodynamically efficient these engines are.

 

I told my wife I thought the car was simply menopausal (hot flushes ;) )- I know there are 7 dog years to a human year - I wonder about car years?

 

Phillip

[jkspoff]

Hi, I was the one who had my Galaxy chipped, I believe this could have been the cause of the overheating problem, however, since having sold my troublesome Galaxy I have found out that a lot of people have had exactly the same type of problems, especially when towing or travelling at speed. I tried absolutely everything, I removed the remap of the ECU, and put it back to standard, I replaced the thermostat, radiator, water pump, checked all hoses, replaced exspansion cap, radiator, the list seems endless, no sniffer picked up on any gases in system, so eventually I had to unfortunately cut my losses and sell it. I just can't do with anything thats unreliable, I have several kids and the last thing I need is a break down, so it had to go, I wonder if anyone who bought it actually got to the route of the problem......anyone on here bought a Galaxy starting with reg Y58........???

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Here's the lastest...I hope this thread is of use to someone in the future!

 

I replaced my bridge with the ambient air temp sensor (wiper arm area) for the booster heater - still fired up this morning, but I know it cut out once engine reached temperature. Found that keeping to a steady 60 kept the temp under control.

 

Rang Frauds and spoke to mechanic who did my car last week - I said about the water pump, but he thought that was alright - when he had the thermostat out he could get his fingers on the impellor and it was metal, not plastic, so it's been done at some point (could still be the water pump though, if the impellor isn't tight on the bearing). I also noticed that the second radiator fan wasn't cutting in, but he said that this might be because it only cuts in when A/C is running - so will be testing this on way home tonight.

 

Anyway, it's going back in on Friday. Will be driving steadily in the meantime.

 

Phillip

[mikeprice]

Quick update on my car, rang OMC Ford who did the water pump and thermostat they said to bring it in and they will test it, if it is that either of them have gone then they are covered on warranty still, if its not then at least I will know and they might even identify the problem Edited April 15, 2008 by mikeprice

[mikeprice]

Well its tested no leaks no pressure loss no blockages waterpump and thermostat working, they went on to say as that showed nothing they can only assume its the Head Gasket and would charge

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Mike,

 

I have put something similar in my Gal (K-Seal), on the recommendation of my mechanic friend, who also has it in his BMW 528; however, the mechanic at Ford said he would never use them (not surprisingly). The Ford mechanic did comment on the "sludge" that was in the system, which I guess was down to that stuff, but could also be down to age of vehicle. I did do some searches on the web - opinion was about 75/25 in favour of it as at least a temporary fix (looked on other non-Ford forums).

 

Coolant flush/replace was on the list of jobs for this summer anyway; Ford replaced the coolant last week - not sure if they actually flushed the system or tried to reverse flush the rad. If they say it's the rad then that's a job I can do.

 

My bottom hose is also cold, which suggests the coolant isn't circulating - and like you, I'm not convinced that would be down to HG failure, especially with the absence of other symptoms associated with HG failure.

 

Mine's going back in to Ford tomorrow - we'll see what they say then.

 

Another thing I have learned - the second fan on the rad cuts in if the air con is switched on.

 

Phillip

[mikeprice]

Ok OMC Ford lied I decided to have a go at the thermostat myself just to check and its not a new one it had coolant rust marks on it, I have replaced it now and checked the waterpump,

 

Took it out for a 60 mile run, it didn't boil any water which it had been doing, but the temperature is still rising quite a lot on a long hill it will rise up to the red, could it also have a dodgy temp gauge/sender I wonder.

 

The bottom hose is still cold is this normal?

 

I haven't tried that Seal Up yet thought I would give it a few days to see what happens as it just doesn't show any signs of a failed HG/cracked head or block.

 

Not sure what else to do atm.

[Ex-Galaxy person]

Mike and all,

 

Ford had it all day yesterday - whilst they didn't take it apart their view is that it's the waterpump that would be the next thing to look at - the mechanic said that the water pump should provide enough pressure that if you squeeze a hose it forces your fingers apart - and it wasn't doing that.

 

It turns out that the water pump isn't run off the timing belt (someone had told me it was) - and the cost from a local motor factors is

[mikeprice]

When i replaced the thermostat I spun the wheel on the water pump and could feel the impellers spinning so I had ruled that out and yes it wasn't a big job to change it, the bottom hose not getting warm is a worry to me and I wonder if it could be ther expansion cap?

 

Other than that I think I will try this seal up stuff incase there is a crack somewhere