No Guts

[dipsomaniac]

matrix blew 2 weeks ago. i bypassed it temporarily, went to start the car but would not fire. eventually got it started but was running very rough.

 

the only thing i removed to access the heater hoses was the scuttle drain, whilst removed there was a couple of downpours resulting in the back of the engine getting wet.

 

i have since removed all of the spark plugs, cleaned them and fitted new ht leads. car will start, seems to tick over ok but as soon as you pull away there is no power and car is 'popping' at low revs. can anybody please answer any of these questions:

 

would bypassing matrix cause these symtoms?

 

would a wet maf cause these symptoms?

 

could water damage the injectors if it entered the air intake?

 

it has now been two weeks since engine got a soaking. I would have thought it would have now dried. the only thing i can think is that i have disturbed something - but what.

 

any help would be very much appreciated.

[Vanbursta]

Did you refit the connector to the MAF (you have to remove it to get the engine cover off)

[dipsomaniac]

yes, i did re-connect the maf. if one cyclinder wasn't firing would it cause the 'popping'?

[sepulchrave]

Sorry dipso but the answers to your questions are: No, no, no and possibly, but even running on five it should pull ok-ish.

 

Are you sure the coil pack is ok? Spray it with a water dispersant.

[dipsomaniac]

i can't be sure coil pack is ok without replacing it. coil pack looks ok, looked last night in the dark and now can't see any arcing from the leads either.

 

i can't see how the coilpack would have become damaged from the water as it is well protected by a ht lead tray. I was told my a mechanic that if coil pack goes it affects 3 cyclinders????????????

 

i am a bit stuck as i have tried everything I can think of (except injectors), vag-com lead isn't working with the software and i can't afford to pay ford

[dipsomaniac]

would car run on 4 cylinders? have pulled two ht leads with no difference in engine beat. popping and struggling under load but runs ok when not under load.

 

i am baffled.

[sepulchrave]

You do have the correct tool to 'pull' the leads? Have you 'read it's head' yet? Have you checked the new plugs, misfiring cylinders will be sooty...

[seatkid]

Have you put the right leads back on the right coil pak connection?

 

Sounds like a couple are wrong....

[dipsomaniac]

'read its head' Sepulchrave? can you explain? i was very careful to put the leads on the right way Seatkid but i will check them again to make sure. the coil pack, leads and trays are all numbered.

[sepulchrave]

...I meant have you run a diagnostic to read the fault memory. I really can't see that anything that got wet has been permanently damaged, you may have connected the new HT leads incorrectly, they are quite difficult to push onto the coil pack due to the angle and cramped access. Also please confirm that you used the correct special tool to hold the plug caps on the HT leads.

[dipsomaniac]

i haven't read any faults codes yet, as i think it is only running on 4 or 5 cyclinders and didn't think it would help diagnose the problem.

 

i have been using the special tool for removing/fitting the ht leads. as i have now replaced the ht leads i will remove the plugs again tomorrow to see if i can identify the cyclinder(s) that are missing. I am hoping that it may be a cracked plug. if it is not, and it is mis-firing i will have to check:

• read fault codes
  
• wiring
  
• coilpack
  
• injectors
  
• compression
  

can anyone add anything to this list?

[anadin]

they used to sell a tool that went between the plug and lead that you could watch to see if the spark was strong/present, a friend had several tested all at the same time , try halfrauds

[Tigger]

Have heard that ruff running can also be down to the fly wheel problem. Have heard that Ford will help with 115,s if they need a new flywheel?

[dipsomaniac]

had the plugs out again. 1 & 5 (back of engine) are black, others all ok (did notice a bit of oil in the plug well of 4). replaced the two plugs but no difference - 1 & 5 are sparking. just to recap.

• back of engine got a soaking while scuttle drain removed to bypass matrix
  
• car now appears to be running on 4 cylinder instead of 6
  
• cleaned plugs
  
• fitted new leads
  

i don't know where to go from here, surely it is not injectors or valves? i am hoping that you chaps can help me out as i can't afford to take it to ford or vw at the moment.

 

 

 

 

 

all of the leads are on the correct coilpack connection

[seatkid]

Try swapping connections for 1 and 5.....and give it a brief go.

[dipsomaniac]

no change seatkid. does anyone know much about the electrical side of the injectors - maybe injectors 1 & 5 are not being sent the electrical signal to spray fuel???

[sepulchrave]

...If there were no fuel getting trough then the plugs would be clean and not sooty!

 

Tigger...IT'S NOT A DIESEL ENGINE! It's the normally very dependable (the most reliable shalaxy engine anyway) petrol V6.

 

This is electrical though and I'm convinced that it's the coilpack. How could the valves possibly have been affected?

[dipsomaniac]

if it was the coilpack, would 1 & 5 still be sparking?

 

do you know much about the fuel injector side supulchrave? are there two rails of three injectors or one rail of six? does anything connect between the ecu and injectors? how does the engine fire? do 2 cylinders fire together?

 

thanks for all your replies

[sepulchrave]

Well there's sparking and there's SPARKING, a twinkle at the electrode doesn't cut it for the VR6!

 

I believe that the cylinders are fired in pairs just like a four. Is it all just a coincidence? I think not.

 

One rail of six injectors BTW, because it isn't a true V6, it's actually a dual plane straight six.

[Guest 3.5bullet]

Firing order is: 1, 5, 3, 6, 2, 4, with a 120

[dipsomaniac]

will clean all of the multiplugs and cover in contact grease before reading fault codes. coilpack really is a last resort due to the cost and the fact that there is a good spark from both 1 & 5 plugs.

 

is there anyone in the gloucester area with vag-com as i can't get my software/hardware to be recognised?

[sepulchrave]

...It's not a V6 because opposing conrods do not share a common big end journal... :lol:

 

Whaddya mean "i can't get my software/hardware to be recognised"?

[dipsomaniac]

bought a lead last year from the US. downloaded the free version of vag-com but whenever i try to connect to car - vag-com says that it can't communicate with car. i am sure that it is the cheap lead at fault.

[sepulchrave]

You need the right version of VAG-COM, 4091. Here is the file if anyone needs it:

[dipsomaniac]

have also looked for advice on the vwvortex forum as i am desperate to sort this out as car has been off the road for a couple of weeks now.

 

had a reply saying that it could not be coilpack as cylinder 1 is triggered by the same coil as 6, & 5 by the same coil as 2. mine is not firing on 1 & 5. it makes sense if the coilpack is split into 3 separate coils??

 

what do you think??