dipsomaniac Posted August 24, 2006 Report Posted August 24, 2006 it never rains but........... just bypassed the matrix went to start the car - turns over but will not start. Ever since I have had the car it has always started on the first turn over. I occassionally also get five beeps and the hazard lights come on. put some fuel in, as meter was reading '0' and wanted to discount fuel. i have taken the battery off at the moment to charge it as five beeps has been linked to a low battery although it was turning the engine quick enough to start. Doh.....the problem is that it took me a couple of days to find a ubend. during this time the scuttle drain was removed and the heavens opened - i just didn't think, the bonnet was down i thought it would be ok. It looks like quite a lot of water ran down the back of the engine. the maf was also disconnect and water entered there.....Doh The engine on occassions tries to fire but will not start. I am hoping that while the battery is charging anything that has got damp will dry out. Does anybody know of any reason why bypassing the matrix will stop the car from starting? Do the pipes to the matrix (that have been bypassed) now need to be blocked? Quote
seatkid Posted August 24, 2006 Report Posted August 24, 2006 Does anybody know of any reason why bypassing the matrix will stop the car from starting? Do the pipes to the matrix (that have been bypassed) now need to be blocked?Maybe you plumbed the cooling system into the fuel system....... :) Quote
Guest HairyPlateEater Posted August 24, 2006 Report Posted August 24, 2006 As long as the matrix has been bled and now empty then no reason to block the pipes. I'd suspect what you are already suspecting - that there is water ingress through the air intake pipe after the maf housing. Hope for a hot day and some good old evaporation and try again! You could also try taking the plugs out and checking them for water, along with coil packs? :( Quote
dipsomaniac Posted August 24, 2006 Author Report Posted August 24, 2006 you used to be helpful seatkid Quote
dipsomaniac Posted August 24, 2006 Author Report Posted August 24, 2006 just read what a load of b*ll*cks i wrote before. bypassed the matrix, car now wont start. i only removed the scuttle drains - had a downpour in between. Quote
dipsomaniac Posted August 24, 2006 Author Report Posted August 24, 2006 managed to get it running, but it is very rough - misfiring and popping. there appears to be a lot of smoke coming from the engine compartment but i can't see where it is coming from. is there anything on the left hand side of engine that i could have disrupted when removing the scuttle drain? Quote
dipsomaniac Posted August 24, 2006 Author Report Posted August 24, 2006 no more smoke from engine compartment but a smell of burning. looked underneath (havent' looked before when engine running) and the middle section of the exhaust (is it cat?) appears to be glowing (red). is this normal? engine is still uneven. can't rev car above 4000rpm. if i try it goes to 4000 then engine management slows the engine down. can you tell i am getting desperate. have to pick up a mate from Heathrow Sunday. will it sort itself out as water dries or have i cocked up? Quote
dipsomaniac Posted August 24, 2006 Author Report Posted August 24, 2006 engine is running a little more even (not perfect) and is now revving above 4000rpm - so can only assume it was water damage. Quote
Guest chrisH Posted August 24, 2006 Report Posted August 24, 2006 I'm sure somebody a long time ago had a glowing exhaust and IIRC they were advised it was fuel being burnt in the exhaust and not the engine ? I think it stuffed the CAT and turbo. Do a search on exhausts, you might find it. :( Quote
sepulchrave Posted August 24, 2006 Report Posted August 24, 2006 Oh dear, just for a change the posters car is NOT, repeat NOT a diesel and therefore does not have a turbo! It is perfectly normal for the Cat to get very hot, this is a good thing and means it's working properly. Dipso, I reckon that you have coil pack or plug lead issues if the coil pack dries out and the problem lessens then you need new plug leads, frankly any VR6 of that age on original leads will need new ones by now, change 'em before winter gets here. Quote
dipsomaniac Posted August 24, 2006 Author Report Posted August 24, 2006 thanks for your replies. I haven't tried it this evening but it did appear to be improving as the day went on (starting was a huge improvement) so I am assumming it was water damage. fitted new plugs and leads last year and am hoping I don't have to do that again. Quote
seatkid Posted August 24, 2006 Report Posted August 24, 2006 you used to be helpful seatkidLet me rephrase...... Water does not mix well with fuel or electricity....I wonder if we should make this a sticky?...... :P If you block the bypass surgery, you will likely blow a pipe or stress the water pump as it is normally the only route for the water to go when the engine is cold. PPS... Allowing a modern petrol engine to run rough for anything other than a short period is a sure way to destroy the catalytic convertor. You pump unburnt petrol into the convertor and it burns in there raising its temperature to the point at which the internals are destroyed. No, they don't normally run red hot...(only unventilated exhaust manifolds and downpipes running at full power do that...). You may have noticed a pungent smell...the smell of a cooked cat .... You are warned about doing this in your manual.... Quote
dipsomaniac Posted August 25, 2006 Author Report Posted August 25, 2006 i can't understand why the car is now not running properly. all i have done is remove scuttle drain, bypass matrix and replace scuttle drain. there was a downpour inbetween which resulted in the back of the engine getting wet but that should have dried out by now. i had most of the left hand side of the engine apart today and can't see anything wrong, the purge valve is making a bit of noise but that shouldn't have the effect of making the car run as rough as it is. the only thing i can see is some arcing on one of the new ht leads but i haven't touched the leads and don't think it would be enough to make it run the way it is. any advice would be very gratefully received as i am supposed to be picking a mate up from heathrow on sunday. Quote
Guest HairyPlateEater Posted August 25, 2006 Report Posted August 25, 2006 Have you ever had the coil packs replaced? Notorious for going on the V6. Quote
seatkid Posted August 25, 2006 Report Posted August 25, 2006 the only thing i can see is some arcing on one of the new ht leads but i haven't touched the leads and don't think it would be enough to make it run the way it is. If you can see it, it definitely will be enough! The lead(s) is shot. Once a bad lead - always a bad lead Damp in leads are just the thing that make the engine run like a dog. The insulation loses its properties and they not only arc to metalwork and adjacent leads but can also just "leak" the spark away silently both to metalwork, adjacent leads and dirty plastic trays. Lift the leads clear of any metalwork/clips/trays to isolate the culprit, and there may be two.... The only sure way - in a dry garage, strip the leads one by one and dry them thoroughly, use a hair dryer, you can try WD40 (but it never ever works for me). Check the leads with a meter. Examine the leads for damage/cracking etc. You may also have water filled up in the spark plug recess. Quote
dipsomaniac Posted August 25, 2006 Author Report Posted August 25, 2006 appears to be cylinder no5. (6 was the one that was arcing) pulled the lead and there was no change. tried another lead but still not firing. i only fitted 6 new ht leads last year. how can i tell if it is the coil pack or is it a case of elimination? once all the lead router trays were removed i saw what a mess ford had made last time they had the car. bad lead & cable routing, they had broken one of the lead router trays and not put back all of the bolts - I paid Quote
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