Vag Com Help Please....very Poorly Gal

[M0GWR]

Ok

My car has been doing some strange things of late

poor starting.....having to turn over for ages then will pick up and go.....this sort of seems to have gone away.

 

Now i have

 

Rough idle

seems down on power

 

Air con also stopped blowing cold but pump is spinning and there is a whooshing noise from passenger foot well.

 

car still returns decent mpg though. Anyway got my vag com working today and have just done a scan. No fault codes. So i look in the meas block park and there is lots of n/a where i am sure there used to be figures. I have attached a log file and hope some one can point me in the right direction.

 

Really concerned now as i have moved work place and have to travel 30 miles a day.

 

The strange thing is in the meas blocks part of vagcom is the missing info. Most things say N/A. The block that shows the injectors is only showing injector number 1 the other 3 say N/A. I really do not have a clue what is going on with it. I have looked around here but not found any similar faults.

[alan_131]

Hi. I'm afraid I can't help with anything informed - broadly unless it's stuff like water in fuel or flaky wiring I'd have expected to see a fault code or maybe looking for timing issues but I'm very far from being an expert and I'd probably be just as surprised as you at the vagcom output - which kind of brings me to the point - for me at least I can't see the attachment.

 

As an afterthought, I don't know how robust the protocol is, but I wonder how good it is at dealing with data corruption in the link cables or heavily loaded laptops (often authors have to do a lot of processing to simulate odd hardware-based protocols and anything after windows98 is pretty rubbish at real-time unless it has hefty gobs of free processor resource)

[M0GWR]

Hi Alan

Thank you for your reply. I do not seem to be able to attach vag com logs but here is a screen grab. The car is really frustrating me now.

VAGCOM SCREEN GRAB.bmp

[alan_131]

What year model box trim level do you have? Wondering if perhaps for some reason lbl file is the wrong one but can't check atm as the laptop with the working battery is out with my GF...

[M0GWR]

What year model box trim level do you have? Wondering if perhaps for some reason lbl file is the wrong one but can't check atm as the laptop with the working battery is out with my GF...

 

 

 

Hi Alan

 

Car is a 2002 1.9tdi gear with 6 speed manual box. I have no idea what a lbl file is.

 

Thank you.

[alan_131]

Summary - you might have already cracked it, but if not try update or reinstall of cable drivers and vcds-lite.

 

Waffley post....

LBL files are somehow used by vagcom / vcds-lite to "interpret" and define the data that goes backwards and forwards and put some information about parameters on the screen I think. I'm pretty confident now that file selection is done automatically by vcds, so led you in the wrong direction with that - apologies.

 

Have you re-installed vcds/vagcom since you last used it, maybe on a different laptop or os (Vista or 7 instead of XP maybe)? Possibly worth trying to update the drivers via windows, otherwise my inclination would be to download a fresh copy of the latest vcds-lite from ross-tech and the drivers from the cable chip manufacturers (ftdi probably - http://www.ftdichip.com/Drivers/VCP.htm), then uninstall and reinstall. I found this reference http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?38558-Measuring-Blocks-N-A to what sounds like a very similar problem, caused by drivers.

 

Did a driver update on my system just now, and it loaded at least one updated (was 2011, now 2012) file - and it still works!

You might know this already, but you need the cable plugged into the laptop to see it in device manager (com ports IIRC) so you can update the driver.

 

Hopefully this will work and codes will give you the information you need to sort the car out!

Good luck

Edited May 29, 2012 by alan_131

[M0GWR]

Summary - you might have already cracked it, but if not try update or reinstall of cable drivers and vcds-lite.

 

Waffley post....

LBL files are somehow used by vagcom / vcds-lite to "interpret" and define the data that goes backwards and forwards and put some information about parameters on the screen I think. I'm pretty confident now that file selection is done automatically by vcds, so led you in the wrong direction with that - apologies.

 

Have you re-installed vcds/vagcom since you last used it, maybe on a different laptop or os (Vista or 7 instead of XP maybe)? Possibly worth trying to update the drivers via windows, otherwise my inclination would be to download a fresh copy of the latest vcds-lite from ross-tech and the drivers from the cable chip manufacturers (ftdi probably - http://www.ftdichip....Drivers/VCP.htm), then uninstall and reinstall. I found this reference http://www.vwaudifor...ring-Blocks-N-A to what sounds like a very similar problem, caused by drivers.

 

Did a driver update on my system just now, and it loaded at least one updated (was 2011, now 2012) file - and it still works!

You might know this already, but you need the cable plugged into the laptop to see it in device manager (com ports IIRC) so you can update the driver.

 

Hopefully this will work and codes will give you the information you need to sort the car out!

Good luck

 

Hi Alan

Thank for taking the time to reply again. I have got it working now....it was indeed a driver issue. I can now see in the mease blocks. Unfortunately i do not really understand them enough to see where the idle problem is coming from. There is no fault codes stored ether. I also can not seem to upload the log file, even when zipped up.

 

Thank You

 

John

[alan_131]

Hi John

Glad you cracked it - only sorry you didn't get any codes. How big is the log file you're trying to upload?

 

Has she had any work done lately? Was the poor starting every time, or only after stopping for a while?

 

I don't know much about PD engines, but is the whooshing noise you describe there only when the a/c is on? If it was me I'd be inclined to think the a/c is a separate issue, (maybe connected in a secondary way - any fault codes from that, could it be easier to hear depending on where the ac flaps are) and the whooshing noise might be an air/boost/vacuum/egr leak?

 

Think from your screen shot you're probably already doing the sort of things I'd do, like looking at req/actual values for clues, but I'm sure that someone more helpful will be along soon. I'd like to know where the whooshing was coming from... System electronics seem to sort out the mechanical roughness at idle, if you see what I mean - certainly on my non-PD disconnecting the lift sensor makes for noticably rougher idle, so I wonder if you've got something that's flakey but not so bad that it flags an error. (crank , maf temp cam sensor? or any of the wiring/connectors). If you think of a possibility I bet there's somebody here who's been there before you. Sorry not to be more help but really beyond my knowledge...

 

Good luck!

Edited May 29, 2012 by alan_131

[alan_131]

Looking thru the forum last night for something else I came across this post http://www.fordgalaxy.org.uk/ford/index.php?/topic/8312-partial-loss-of-refrigerant-again/page__p__63129__hl__partial+loss__fromsearch__1#entry63129 which describes a noise from the a/c. Just wondered if this sounded like your whooshing?

[M0GWR]

Looking thru the forum last night for something else I came across this post http://www.fordgalax...h__1#entry63129 which describes a noise from the a/c. Just wondered if this sounded like your whooshing?

 

That does indeed sound about the right place. I will get it checked after the running problem is sorted. Thanks again Alan for your help.

[seatkid]

Your 2002 model will have a PD engine. Rough Idle is often a faulty injector loom or connectors. Do a search to find out more.

 

Whoosing noise from passenger footwell is normal when recirculation is turned on - the air intake is then from that area. if recirc is definately not on then "kettling" type noises are usually an indication that a/c gas is low. (but not low enough for the pressure switch to inhibit the pump), in this case cooling is very weak.

 

No cold air from a/c - how do you know pump is spinning? Does the electromagnetic clutch clack loudly when you select a/c along with a momentary dip in revs?

Edited May 30, 2012 by seatkid

[M0GWR]

Your 2002 model will have a PD engine. Rough Idle is often a faulty injector loom or connectors. Do a search to find out more.

 

Whoosing noise from passenger footwell is normal when recirculation is turned on - the air intake is then from that area. if recirc is definately not on then "kettling" type noises are usually an indication that a/c gas is low. (but not low enough for the pressure switch to inhibit the pump), in this case cooling is very weak.

 

No cold air from a/c - how do you know pump is spinning? Does the electromagnetic clutch clack loudly when you select a/c along with a momentary dip in revs?

 

Thank you for the info on the loom, is there anyway of testing it at all?

[seatkid]

Thank you for the info on the loom, is there anyway of testing it at all?

 

Most people have a go at cleaning /remaking the connectors first (sometimes works)

 

Recently posted photo showing connectors - http://www.fordgalaxy.org.uk/ford/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=5985

Edited May 30, 2012 by seatkid

[M0GWR]

Bit of an update...

 

I have just changed the loom and it has not helped. When you first start up it will idle nice and smooth but after a short while it starts with the rough almost miss firing sound.

 

This did just start all of a sudden, came out one morning for work and it just didn't seem to want to start. I had to wind it over for quite a while and then it picked up and ran fine, that was until it sat for most of the day to come home. Same again next morning etc. Then all of a sudden it was back to starting first flick of the key but with the rough idle. Now thinking back the only things i have done is swooped from Morrison's fuel to Total and at the same time put some forte (sp) injector cleaner in.

 

I look as best i could at the cam shaft and it looked and felt ok, and i also put a dmm on the injectors and they all read about the same 0.5/6 ohm iirc.

 

Is there anything in vag com that will show if the fuel pressure is ok?

 

Thank you

 

John

Edited May 31, 2012 by M0GWR

[alan_131]

Sorry to hear that - I had high hopes....

 

AFAIK you can see things like fuel temp and injection rates but I don't recall seeing fuel pressure. Might sound like a silly question but I think the PD cars have a tank fuel pump that you should be able to hear when the ignition is first switched on?

 

Can I just check a few things with you?

The whooshing noise is down to the A/C?

Car is still down on power, but starts as soon as you turn the key (or is it that it starts better than when it was really bad - but not as well as before all this began?

 

I wonder if there might be a clue in how long it takes for the rough idle to start? Is it the same no matter if the car is hot or cold? Is the idle always rough, once it's started? Does it run smoothly for a few seconds, or longer/shorter? (7-10 secs maybe?)

 

FWIW (probably not much) sort of thinking out loud, it seems to me that one of two things are happening for the rough idle

Something that works when it's cold is going out of wack when it warms up

The ecu is instructing something to change and that triggers the problem

 

Do you think it's worth trying to check a couple of things in vcds?

With the engine off and cold, check all the temps are around ambient

Log the measuring blocks for egr, and for idle stabilisation block 13

Start the engine, and when the idle goes rough, click the mark (or whatever it's called) in the bottom left corner

 

Once the engine is warm and at idle, look at block 4 to check torsion value.

 

This http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/multi/PD-adjust-Idle-TDI.htm explains it better than I can, and why I'm suggesting might be worth a look.

Good luck!

[alan_131]

I found this helpful (originally from VW America) http://www.myarchive.us/richc/VW_TDI_with_PumpeDuse.pdf

 

Sorry - can't tell my left from my right it seems. Reading my last post I notice that I described the mark box as being in the Bottom Left corner.

IIRC that should have been the Bottom Right Corner...

[bfc1001]

http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/m_blocks/010-019.html

 

hope this helps.

[M0GWR]

UPDATE

 

Had the pump out the tank this morning. It was a little dirty but not bad for a 10 year old car. Cleaned it all and checked it is working. Put it all back together and decided to check the timing.......well that was until i found that my locking wheel nut socket is missing......do not think body shop had put it back in the car last month :o

[alan_131]

Never rains etc... Any possible connection between bodyshop visit and your current problems?

 

I'd think you might be able to get a quick indication of timing just from vcds - the torsion value is apparently equivalent to advance, though a proper mechanical check first is obviously better - reassuring for valve timing etc.

Any luck with timing how long before the uneven idle starts? Once it starts, is it there at all times until the next cold start or do you get a short period of smooth running after each start-up?

Others will be able to interpret the delay better than I can, I'm wondering if it's the alternator clutch siezed, and this either takes a few moments to build up or the alternator might have a "soft start" system so it doesn't show at once...

Good luck - must be getting a bit frustrating...