New Keys

[bcitral]

Has anyone found a cheaper option than a main dealer for a duplicate key?

 

Ive got one original but Im getting freaked about losing it.

 

Thanks B

[bj2004]

you can buy keys off e bay check its same frequency tho written on side of key

timpsons will cut it for about

[bcitral]

Thanks BJ,

 

We got one cut this morning but with no chip. At least we can get into the car if we lock the keys in it. :rolleyes:

 

Don't really fancy spending

[Mirez]

A quick point to be wary of here, most of the time the mobile places are cloning keys, not coding the car's module.

 

For anyone that's interested: Each key has a transponder in it (basically a unique digital code) that's read by the car at ignition on. The car's immobiliser (PATS on Galaxys, IMMO on sharans/alhambras) has a reference table of the "accepted" codes (up to 8). If the coding is done properly then a second key's code is added into this table, so you have two unique keys with two unique codes and a clear difference for the PATS system to see - thus allowing further coding at home.

 

What the cheaper mobile places tend to do is read the code from the existing working key (key1) and then overwrite the transponder in the replacement (key2) with key1's code. The car's code table isn't altered so as far as the PATS system is concerned only one key is "known". Regardless of which key is then used to start the key, the code is always the same from both and hence the car starts. There are two massive downside to this however, one is that you don't have unique codes/keys and therefore can't programme anymore yourself. Two is that should the key be stolen you can't have it removed from the "accepted" code table as you'll also disable the second. There is also the rare chance that if code1 in the table gets corrupted, both keys will fail to work.

 

Its a matter or cost over reason I guess - but very few of the cheaper places will admit thats what they are doing when they "code" a replacment key for you.

Edited June 8, 2010 by Mirez

[frogeye]

For anyone that's interested: Each key has a transponder in it (basically a unique digital code) that's read by the car at ignition on. The car's immobiliser (PATS on Galaxys, IMMO on sharans/alhambras) has a reference table of the "accepted" codes (up to 8). If the coding is done properly then a second key's code is added into this table, so you have two unique keys with two unique codes and a clear difference for the PATS system to see - thus allowing further coding at home.

 

Hi Mirez,

 

Is there software available to be able to write acceptable codes in to the reference table? Or is it encrypted and these rather high costs are to pay for licensing fees for the encyption software? Apparently there is software out there that lets you modify your mileage, adding a key code to PATS would seem to be less of an issue than that.

 

Frogeye

[Mirez]

The software for the mileage is a doddle, I have it but that info is held in the cluster (VDO) and is just a hex string, no encrytion or protection :rolleyes:

 

Both the PATS and IMMO system are fully encrypted, and both hold the decypher code embeded into the same controller. That code can only be read with yet another code, and that ones manufacturer only, with the dealers needing to request it directly. The modern VW's go one step further - the "GECKO" system as they call it is 100% private, once the dealer has contacted VW direct and got authorisation, they connect the car to the PC and the encryption, coding and authentication all takes place directly with VW's server with no codes being visable to the end dealer. Its also a one shot deal so if they screw up or disconnect the car too soon they need to get authorisation again!

 

The upshot is that I'm not aware of any software publicly available that can write to either of the systems :(

[bcitral]

Wow Mirez,

 

Thanks for the invaluable info. It is far clearer now how the system works.

 

Can anyone recomemmend a good auto locksmith to recode / clone a key?

 

Thanks Paul

[frogeye]

Can anyone recomemmend a good auto locksmith to recode / clone a key?

 

Thanks Paul

 

Quite a few Timpsons can now program keys, the one in Cambridge charges about

[gregers]

my local timpsons cannot program our keys,they can cut them but thats it so far,next time im in town ill ask them.

i have recently approached a locksmith company who have told me there looking into obtaining the correct equipment to program/clone keys.

[kebrina]

My local Timpsons cut and programme the key for