Non Starter

[kenclarke]

Hi

 

Just been out to galaxy and it won't turn over plenty of life in battery, and it turned over ok this morning, but U'm getting nothing, all lights on ok just nothing not even a click from starter.

Any ideas folks

[Guest brooksie]

What model is your Gal?

I have a 02 2.3 petrol manual that does this occasionally, I have eliminated battery, starter motor,, key (immobiliser chip) and checked the loom for iffy connections, just about to delve deeper into the key switch and I have been told R26 relay controls the starter so could be the cause.

[kenclarke]

What model is your Gal?

I have a 02 2.3 petrol manual that does this occasionally, I have eliminated battery, starter motor,, key (immobiliser chip) and checked the loom for iffy connections, just about to delve deeper into the key switch and I have been told R26 relay controls the starter so could be the cause.

 

Hi

My Galaxy is a 99 tdi, I would have a guess at a relay but not a clue which as I am a newbie to this car

[Scorpiorefugee]

The first thing to eliminate is the chip in the key. Do you have a spare key. It is common for the chip to drop out of the key with the remote on if the remote section is separated either by accident or when changng batteries.

[kenclarke]

The first thing to eliminate is the chip in the key. Do you have a spare key. It is common for the chip to drop out of the key with the remote on if the remote section is separated either by accident or when changng batteries.

Thanks but have checked key and chip it all seems fine

[sparky Paul]

Thanks but have checked key and chip it all seems fine

The transponder chips in the key have been known to fail... I've not heard of many problems with the Galaxy specifically, but Renaults are well known for intermittant starting because of this problem.

 

It is worth trying a second key if you have one.

 

What is the LED on the driver's door doing when you insert the key?

Edited July 14, 2009 by sparky Paul

[turk90210]

I think your sending Ken down the wrong road re the key/immobilizer as the engine cranks and immidiatly cuts out if that is the fault does it not????

He said that it wont turn over not even a click so my best guess would be the starter circuit starting from the ignition switch, wiring, relays and the starter itself, nearly forgot if an auto it will have an inhibitor switch fitted aswell to stop it turning over unless in neutral or park. Dont forget the Battery either, just because the lights ect might work doesnt necessary mean there is enough power to turn the starter

Do you have a multimeter, if so I'm sure we can guide you through basic checks

[mikej]

As above : What is the LED on the driver's door doing when you insert the key?

[kenclarke]

I think your sending Ken down the wrong road re the key/immobilizer as the engine cranks and immidiatly cuts out if that is the fault does it not????

He said that it wont turn over not even a click so my best guess would be the starter circuit starting from the ignition switch, wiring, relays and the starter itself, nearly forgot if an auto it will have an inhibitor switch fitted aswell to stop it turning over unless in neutral or park. Dont forget the Battery either, just because the lights ect might work doesnt necessary mean there is enough power to turn the starter

Do you have a multimeter, if so I'm sure we can guide you through basic checks

Hi

I have tried with a different battery so I know that not the cause and the car is a manual box, everything seem to be working fine except the starter circuit, is ther a relay what develops certain faults maybe?

[sparky Paul]

I think your sending Ken down the wrong road re the key/immobilizer as the engine cranks and immidiatly cuts out if that is the fault does it not????

 

Turk's right, my fault for not reading the thread fully. Immobiliser will not stop the starter cranking.

 

Fuse F26, and relay R26 (starter power) are the first things to check. R26 is marked '100' on the actual panel IIRC.

[seatkid]

Time to get the big hammer out........

[big_kev]

Does it bump start ?

[mikej]

I,ve had this myself in the past on my own 2.3 but when it happened the drivers door led would flash rapidily as i turned the key, you couldn't even hear the fuel pump kicking in, nothing. Sorry i can't help you mind as it corrected it's self after a week or so, i was under the impression it was the PATS as once or twice after fiddling with the key in the ignition you could hear the fuel pump start and the car started but i must have been mistaken then? sounds like a iffy relay to me.

[Scorpiorefugee]

There seems to be something strange. I have lost (and found again) the chip out of my key and on every occasion the ignition light comes on and the engine will not crank so, just in case, if not proved otherwise, do not discount this possibility.

 

When chngng the battery, I assume you mean the car batery and not the handset. The latter will have no effect and if the main battery is dead or the engine is siezed, therewill be a click and the lights will dim when the starter is operated.

[cyborg]

hi I had the non start problem not so long ago,A way to test if pats is faulty is try disconnecting positive and neg battery leave for 20 mins

then put your key in the lock and turn to position one then reconnect battery neg first if it starts then ecu ok if you turn off and on again it wont start as pats cuts in

 

The pats system consists of

 

a chip in your key

 

a ring sensor that's on the steering coloum

 

a wire from sensor that connects the pats box which lives under the ecu box which is behind the clocks

 

which has some white wires to relays for fuel pump etc .

 

in my case the pats had failed so i got new keys door handles ecu and pats for 45 squid from ebay good luck with yours apparently theres a bloke on peterborough market that can do a key ^^ which will work for 45 also don't ask me who i think it might be urban legend as bloke who told me does talk it a lot.

[kenclarke]

Does it bump start ?

car still won't turn over and i have towed car up and down street getting nothing, not even attempting to fire, when i put key in led on door comes on for couple of secs then goes out does nothing when key is turned.

[big_kev]

There is no fuel getting to the engine otherwise it would fire ( its a diesel ).

 

Either no fuel.....unlikely

Faulty fuel pump....or no power to it, Relay, Fuse.

No power to fuel cut off valve.....Relay, Inhibiter, Fuse.

Or other very unlikely multiple fault.

 

Try putting a direct feed to the fuel cut off valve....and try bump/jump starting it.

[kenclarke]

There is no fuel getting to the engine otherwise it would fire ( its a diesel ).

 

Either no fuel.....unlikely

Faulty fuel pump....or no power to it, Relay, Fuse.

No power to fuel cut off valve.....Relay, Inhibiter, Fuse.

Or other very unlikely multiple fault.

 

Try putting a direct feed to the fuel cut off valve....and try bump/jump starting it.

but engine not even turning over when key is turned so could something be stopping power getting to starter

[big_kev]

Could be battery or starter problem ........but it should still bump start.

 

You need to check if the fuel pump is running first.

[kenclarke]

Could be battery or starter problem ........but it should still bump start.

 

You need to check if the fuel pump is running first.

Hi

Thanks for help turned out it was the earth strap on starter motor had meltled through, renewed earth strap and now turning over fine, but still not starting.

Got fuel upto pump but nothing coming out of hp lines, head had been off for skimming so fuel lines disconnected for a while. Is there a special way of purging system as there is no lift pumo or priming pump on these cars what I can see. Is it just a case of cranking over until I get fuel or should i be doing something else a fuel bleed screw etc.

thanks

ken

[big_kev]

Is the fuel cut off valve powered up ? Edited August 2, 2009 by big_kev

[kenclarke]

Is the fuel cut off valve powered up ?

not sure what i'm checking for is it a 12v feed on diesel pump

[sepulchrave]

Sorry, but I got that your car is a '99 TDi, but if it's a PD engine then you ain't gonna have much luck finding the diesel pump and cut off valve!

 

The fuel system is completely electronically controlled on PD lumps, have you checked the connections to the unit injectors and the multiplug to the head loom?

 

If yours is a late non-PD engine then you're looking for a small solenoid on the fuel pump with a single wire connected to it, this energises when the ignition is switched on and allows fuel into the pump from the LP line. Check you have 12v at this connection.

[kenclarke]

Sorry, but I got that your car is a '99 TDi, but if it's a PD engine then you ain't gonna have much luck finding the diesel pump and cut off valve!

 

The fuel system is completely electronically controlled on PD lumps, have you checked the connections to the unit injectors and the multiplug to the head loom?

 

If yours is a late non-PD engine then you're looking for a small solenoid on the fuel pump with a single wire connected to it, this energises when the ignition is switched on and allows fuel into the pump from the LP line. Check you have 12v at this connection.

have found the connection to the solenoid 12v comes on briefly when ignition is switched on then goes off there is no 12v feed when engine is being cranked

[seatkid]

PD engines have a low pressure electric fuel pump located in the fuel tank. So advice for these engines to check fuse,relay applies.

 

have found the connection to the solenoid 12v comes on briefly when ignition is switched on then goes off there is no 12v feed when engine is being cranked

 

THis sounds like immobiliser problem - 1st check, check for PATS chip in key, this often drop out when the key is opened to change battery etc.

Edited August 2, 2009 by seatkid