Intermittent Won't Start

[ed austin]

Hi all,

 

This is my first post. This is an excellent forum - I wish I had found it earlier!

 

I've searched but can't find an answer to my problem.

 

Occasionally, but now more frequently (currently once every couple of days), my 97 v6 galaxy ghia auto won't start. I turn the key, the starter motor runs, (and so does another small motor - fuel pump?) but it won't catch. I've not found a consistent way to get it out of the failure condition, though usually after about 10 mins I will turn the key and it will start as if nothing's wrong. It seems to happen more when the engine is warm.

 

Does this sound like an immobaliser problem? Would the starter motor run at all if the immobaliser was engaged? If so can I bypass it somehow?

 

I've tried removing and re-inserting the key, and using the red key. I've also had a look at the controller under the passanger seat, and this is totally dry and free of any corrosion. I've not been able to assertain if there is a spark during failure, because I'm always away from my tools!!

 

I'd very much appreciate any help or advice.

 

Thanks

 

Ed

[suzuki91]

search for relay 30.

[ed austin]

thanks for this. I've seen many posts about this, but they seem to say that the v6 doesn't have a relay 30. Is that correct?

[johnswlondon]

sounds like a transponder fault-have you tried using a different key,or seeing if the problem occurs between locking/unlocking car,suggesting an alarm fault

[ed austin]

Thanks yeah I thought it might be an alarm fault. I've tried different keys, and locking and unlocking the door, no difference. The LED on the door always comes on constantly for 3 seconds then switches off, which I believe indicates that the immobaliser is OK. Is it possible that the LED has this behaviour and yet there's still a problem with the immobaliser?

 

I also thought it might be vapour lock - would this ring any bells with anyone? The fuel pressure regulator seems to be fine (no fuel in vacuum lines). I'm going to change the fuel filter, but I don't think this is the problem.

 

I've taken it to Hendy's and they don't know what's wrong with it either. They couldn't replicate the fault. Please help anyone!! This is driving me crazy!!

[seatkid]

I've taken it to Hendy's and they don't know what's wrong with it either. They couldn't replicate the fault. Please help anyone!! This is driving me crazy!!

Are you sure you don't have more than one key on your key ring, even for another car/make, or in your pocket.

 

I believe two transponders in range at once confuse the immobiliser.

[ed austin]

hiya and thanks, but nope no other keys anywhere near.

 

The problem has progressed. Today on my way home, whilst I was stopped in traffic, the engine just died. After about 5 mins of cranking and head scratching and swearing it suddenly started again, then ran fine. It must be some sensor gone wrong - but surely this would show up on Ford's diagnostic equipment?

In an attempt to solve the problem, I have purcahsed an OBD lead from ebay, an OBD2 KKL KWP-2000, but can't make it work with my car, a 97 Ford Galaxy 2.8 v6. Should it?

 

thanks all for your help so far!!

 

ed

[seatkid]

As suzuki91 says

 

Look at FAQ 36 - Relay 30 Fuel Pump Relay (sometimes labelled 27)

 

IIRC There are a number of reports posted that wiring to the relay holder or the connections come adrift or get (heat?) damaged leading to intermittent operation as well as faulty relay.

Edited August 29, 2007 by seatkid

[ed austin]

I think I fixed it!

 

I thought I'd put down my diagnostic procedure - maybe it will help others:

 

1) Thought it was an immobaliser fault, but in ignition, the LED on the door glowed steadily for 3-4 seconds then switched off, indicating that the immobaliser was not stopping the engine starting

 

2) Many suggested it was something to do with the fuel pump. I checked the diaghram in the fuel pressure regulator by removing one of the vacuum hoses and smelling and looking for fuel. nothing. I finally removed the possibility of a fuel pump problem when the problem progressed and the engine started just cutting out at idle during normal use, rather than failing to start. The engine cut out cleanly and immediately, which seemed to suggest I did not have a fuel problem. To check this, I removed the fuel pump fuse (F18) while the car was running, and rather than die immediately, it coughed for about 20 seconds, desparately sucking fuel from the tank. Hence I convinced myself it wasn't a fuel problem.

 

3) In desparation I took the car to hendies, who said it was a camshaft position sensor problem after putting on their diagnostic. I changed the camshaft position sensor - no difference.

 

4) I bought a OBDII lead from ebay and diagnosed the engine myself with Vag-com. I first cleared all the previous errors, then ran the car until it failed, and diagnosed again. The only error was intermittent crankshaft position sensor, wich makes sense for the problem I'm having

 

5) Installed a new crankshaft position sensor, and with luck, it now works!!

 

Thanks to everyone for all your help!!

Edited September 6, 2007 by ed austin

[cody]

I think I fixed it!

 

I thought I'd put down my diagnostic procedure - maybe it will help others:

 

1) Thought it was an immobaliser fault, but in ignition, the LED on the door glowed steadily for 3-4 seconds then switched off, indicating that the immobaliser was not stopping the engine starting

 

2) Many suggested it was something to do with the fuel pump. I checked the diaghram in the fuel pressure regulator by removing one of the vacuum hoses and smelling and looking for fuel. nothing. I finally removed the possibility of a fuel pump problem when the problem progressed and the engine started just cutting out at idle during normal use, rather than failing to start. The engine cut out cleanly and immediately, which seemed to suggest I did not have a fuel problem. To check this, I removed the fuel pump fuse (F18) while the car was running, and rather than die immediately, it coughed for about 20 seconds, desparately sucking fuel from the tank. Hence I convinced myself it wasn't a fuel problem.

 

3) In desparation I took the car to hendies, who said it was a camshaft position sensor problem after putting on their diagnostic. I changed the camshaft position sensor - no difference.

 

4) I bought a OBDII lead from ebay and diagnosed the engine myself with Vag-com. I first cleared all the previous errors, then ran the car until it failed, and diagnosed again. The only error was intermittent crankshaft position sensor, wich makes sense for the problem I'm having

 

5) Installed a new crankshaft position sensor, and with luck, it now works!!

 

Thanks to everyone for all your help!!

 

Ed out of interest how much was the crank position and cam shaft sensor?

 

Cheers