The Red Arrows Are Under Threat

[Andrew T]

You may or may not agree with this, but I thought I'd bring it to your attention.

 

 

The RED ARROWS aerobatic squadron of the Royal Air Force brings huge pride and international prestige to the UK, but the Treasury bean-counters in our beloved Government want to axe the Reds to save a couple of shillings. The personnel, pilots and aircraft of the squadron are all capable of deployment elsewhere in the RAF, so the money really saved would be peanuts.

 

Cynics might observe that the move is a covert campaign to expunge from the public mind a potent and highly visible symbol of the very best of the Royal Air Force as an independent Air Arm of a United Kingdom giving up its identity to Europe...

 

10 Downing St website has an online petition. Save the Red Arrows.http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/SaveTheReds/

Please sign it. Don't let them get away with this.

Please could you pass this on to those you know who also care.

[mumof4]

Hmmm..you know.....i havent signed this petition ..as to be honest....even though the red arrows are pretty cool..there are service personnel out there fighting wars without the correct gear as the government doesnt have the money to equip them properly....the services are soo stretched at the moment that if things got worse abroad then it would break...I believe the money is better spent elsewhere on the services in this present climate we are in...iran..iraq..Afghanistan..then you have service personnel detached to the falklands...the services is seriously undermanned at the moment and are stretched to breaking point..and the morale is utterly crap with people leaving the services every single day..it is soo bad that a lot of service personnel cant even get leave in and some personnel are drafted from one camp to another to cover for those who go sick..The british troops are not happy at the mo ..and who would you like fighting for this country?..a soldier who is well equipped..and happy in his job?..or one who is p**** off. with not enough equipment to keep him safe and doesnt care anymore..

 

here are a few views taken from a services forum i frequent..make your own mind up with seeing both sides of the coin...

 

As much as my kids, wife and I engoy watching them, I cannot help but think that It might be worth getting rid if it means extra funding would be made available to the masses who are striving for personal kit, spares for "Operational" A/C and basics like decent accomodation. Yes the Scarlet Tarts are a good ad for the RAF and HM Forces but would we rather have them in the papers than guys at Brize with cr@p quarters

 

 

"The UK's defence spending, as a proportion of GDP, is at its lowest since 1931, yet at 2.1% the country is still classed as a big spender when compared with other European nations: France's spending is less than 2%, Germany's is 1.4%, Spain's is 1.3% and Italy's is approximately 1%."

 

It wouldn't be the fact that they would be prepared to bin the reds to give MQ's a revamp or spend it on kit for the front line. It would be that the purse strings have been tightened that much that they can't afford to keep them barrel rolling around the world!

 

Think that goes to show how much they are cutting defence spending!

 

At least with the threat of the Reds going Joe Public might sit up and take note; they do not do so when front line equipment is cut

 

Can't see it happening myself. The Sparrows are an integral part of the UK identity worldwide, not just the RAF. Any sane Government (or is that an oxymoron) would be foolish to do so. As has been said, any 'savings' would not benefit HM Forces, just get swallowed up in that big black hole that is The Exchequer

[Guest MATT jr]

the answer to all our problems is to make Briton for Briton and screw everyone else!

 

i don't think we should ever of got involved with the American war on Iraq - i don't like Europe, and i don't like the amount of people coming into the country, and i don't like the amount of British people leaving the county.

 

concord should never have been put out of service, and the red arrows should continue their excellent work -- they put such a warming feeling in my heart when i see there displays - to think that is our standard of service.

 

REAL money can be saved in so many other ways - i personally think we need a more business orientated government.

 

our current gov seem to waste money by the bucket fulls, and their answer to the problem, is charge more tax.

 

MJR

[Guest MATT jr]

..signed.

 

MJR

[mumof4]

to think that is our standard of service.

 

MJR

 

 

standard of service...for pilots maybe..for ground forces not always..I do like the red arrows and i can see both sides of the coin..yes they are a great team and are a visable display for the forces....But there are a lot of disguntled troops out there..

 

The government we have is crap and it is their mismanagement which has caused so much chaos ..It os true that ethnic minorities are no longer the minorities and they do seem to have more rights than us natives which i believe is soo very wrong..

 

Anyway..back on topic.....i guess that if i was a civvy on the street not knowing what i do then yes i would sign..but when i hear of all the shortfalls the ground troops have and the needless deaths that have occurred..and my friend who lost her husband on active duty...then i cannot sign it...we all have our different opinions and are entitled to them....The red arrows are a remarkable display team and have a great history and it would be a shame to lose them...but i still cannot sign the petition..sorry but is the way i feel and is just my opinion.

[Guest MATT jr]

it is disgusting that our government has sent our troops in with the wrong equipment/not enough equipment to do the job, and i am saddened by the human loss always associated by war, and the grief and upset it causes for loved ones.

 

MJR

[gregers]

is this what you are studying at university matt accountancy(subsidized no doubt)so we could make a saving there then eh?but i do agree on the amount of people coming to this country and not contributing to it and sucking it dry and then complaining about this and that,THATS WHERE ALL THE MONEY HAS GONE and i agree with you maz in a lot of what you say after all you do see it from a personell point of view,down my way we have an air show every year and the arrows come for the 3 days it is on,its great for the commerce of the town(or so they tell us)but personally i dont see it in my wallet,only the town has an extra 500000 people in it over this time causing bedlam and congestion,but i also thought that the arrows charged for doing the air shows so are they not self sufficient?

 

also do you really think the govement are going to have a change of heart over a petition like this when they have totally disregarded the motoring one when there is an awful lot more cause for concern?ME THINKS NOT!!!

[Grumpy]

I dont know about the rest of you but I seem to be paying more and more tax for less and less services.

 

Our local hospital has closed its emergency dept, it has closed its maternity dept. We now have to travel 15 miles (OK nor too far but the old one was 2 miles) to the next hospital then pay an arm and leg to park (surley a form of tax for using the hospital)

 

The police service seems to have been replaced with GATSOS, the army it seems is under funded, under equiped and overloaded. The Navy is heading towards a Navy without ships (well not very many)

 

The bin men wont walk 5 feet down my front path to empty my bin.

 

The roads are over crowded and badly maintained

 

If I want to get away I have to pay more tax on my airline ticket

 

If I decide to hide in a bottle I have to pay more than the rest of Europe to buy it.

 

My motorbike got nicked but the police only wanted to know how well I thaught they answered the phone

 

My council tax keeps going up

 

And now we cant afford the Red Arrows

 

Where is my tax going

 

I am getting so p!$$ed of with this country under the dictatorship of Phoney Tony

 

ps

 

And you wondered why I call myself Grumpy?

[Guest MATT jr]

gregers...im studying business and computer science - but i have got an A level in accountancy :wub: :rolleyes:

 

a quote from the reds page.

Acknowledged as one of the world

[mumof4]

recruitment is down in the Forces....and the government is cutting defence costs left right and centre but still sends troops abroad..the government takes the money allocated for the refurbishment and repairs of quarters and uses that to fund the troops abroad.the pay rise the government awards service personnel is more than swallowed up with every thing we pay for..heating bills are astronomical in the quarters as there is inadequate insulation...

 

ah well..im out of this argument.....If you knew what it is like in the RAF today....then you would understand.It has changed rapidly in the last couple of years and not for the better either.

[mumof4]

You really think that the government will admit that the forces are at breaking point?no..they want you to believe that everything is hunky dorey and that our country can defend itself..What with?..bases closeing all over the country..and when a base closes the government has to compensate the local area..in the shetlands, i believe that ran into thehundreds of thousands in lost revenue(could be wrong on the figure)

 

When a base closes there is the loss of jobs...the cost of relocating the troops to another base and the cost to the local area in lost revenue..the forces lose money left right and centre and it is the troops that pay for it all....if you worked out how much a service personnel got paid by the hour...it would vary from about 3 quid an hour upwards....24 hours a day they are on call..they can be on holiday and get an order that their leave has been cancelled and to report to duty...they get treated like crap ...

 

if the government hadnt of cokced up big dstyle..then there wouldnt be the problem with the Red Arrows......they should stay..but no matter how many petitions that get signed..it will not affect whatever decision that is made.

 

sorry..off me soap box now.

[Guest MATT jr]

im not saying there isnt a problem with our forces, what i am saying, is getting shut of the red arrows will not solve anything...i think bringing the reds to an end will cause more bad than good.

 

Mr Blair and his cronies are more bothered about helping everyone but us...

 

 

MJR :rolleyes:

[mumof4]

I do agree that gewtting rid of the reds is a bad move....but if they dont...the money the defence needs will have to come from somewhere..and the first place they take it from is funds allocated to improve the quarters to a standard where they aren't falling down around our ears...then there is redundancies..either voluntary or compulsary....If it aint the reds..it will be something else....

[mumof4]

some personnel on this base were issued mobile phones for emergencies..god knows why....and the monthly cost of those phones being used was 27k!!..explain that one!!..Beggers belief as to how screwed up the system is in the forces.

 

Im really shutting up now.

 

sorry.

[Guest MATT jr]